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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:25 am 
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Paul Kierstead wrote:
I think your description nails the problem on the head. It isn't that there are unnecessary steps, it is that the steps and instructions required vary by the skill and experience of the cook.


Well, that's one reason. The other reasons for lots of steps are (b) fiddly uber-perfectionism, and (c) making the recipe "theirs".

Per (b), frequently old CI recipes would require you to use an extra pan and bowl and three extra steps just to get a tiny bit of extra flavor or texture for the recipe. As an example of this, I did their "fresh salmon cake" recipe, first as written and then a tremendously simplified version which required 2 less ingredients and took about half the time. It wasn't just as good, but I'd say that it was 85% as good. And it wasn't a case of my skill level, because I gave the simplified version to a non-foodie neighbor and it's become their go-to salmon cake recipe (they fish a lot).

So a lot of the complexity of the recipes in old CI was about getting that extra 10% quality. Which is fine; that meant that if I ever wanted that last 10% quality, I knew the steps to get it, and I could simplify the recipe on my own. Wheras a magazine which presents only the simplified recipes gives me no information on how to take those recipes to the next level if I have the time and the dishes.

Re (c), once CI developed their theme of fiddly perfectionism, they couldn't really deviate from it. For example, it wasn't possible for them to try a traditional food and, through testing, conclude that the traditional recipe really was best; they had to change it, or it wasn't a CI recipe. The Pasta Carbonara recipe from around 10 years ago comes to mind.

Now, in CI's decline (anytime after about 2006, really), they started resorting to fiddly complex recipes as an excuse to redo the same recipes they'd printed three years previous. They could make it more fiddly, or swap a couple of steps, and -- voila! -- new recipe.

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A really great example would be hollandaise. You can make it very very simply and extremely fast using the direct method ... ... The fast method is very delicate; a very small error will result in a complete failure. The bain-marie method is very tolerant, but takes more time, requires more explanation and dirties more dishes.


Hmmmm. I keep hearing how fragile hollandaise is, but I've never seen it. In my experience, it's one of the easiest, most handling-tolerant sauces there is, short of a bechamel. I keep thinking that people who find it hard have bad proportions or poor ingredients.

Anyway, in general the best thing I got out of CI recipes wasn't the recipes themselves, but some of the techniques. Like, just tonight I used the techniques of layering cheese on the bottom of a calzone, and cutting slits in the top. Unfortunately, by 2007 I was no longer learning any techniques from CI; they'd lost either the desire or the ability to come up with new ones.

Paul Kierstead wrote:
I think the negativity of folks like that will lead to an earlier death than eating a grilled bratwurst now and then. Or at least perhaps they will just wish they were dead. :twisted:


If you eat right, exercise heavily, and avoid caffeine and alcohol, you will live much longer. Or at least it will seem much longer.

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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:25 am 
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TheFuzzy wrote:
Hmmmm. I keep hearing how fragile hollandaise is, but I've never seen it. In my experience, it's one of the easiest, most handling-tolerant sauces there is, short of a bechamel. I keep thinking that people who find it hard have bad proportions or poor ingredients.


In the method I was referring to, the time period between undercooked and overcooked egg yolks is a few seconds (maybe 5, even less if the heat is higher). Either case will likely cause the resultant sauce to break when you add the butter. OTOH, the bain-marie method (or blender method) it is hard to go wrong if you remotely follow directions.


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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:09 am 
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Location: Springfield, IL
Hi,

Cook's Illustrated is a great place to learn the best new methods and sometimes presents a legitimate breakthrough. Nevertheless, it is helpful to do some research before completely accepting their "innovation". In many cases, you will discover that they have merely adapted (stolen and taken credit for) techniques developed by others. ie: dry-brining poultry

They also tend to dumb-down ingredients to those widely available; this sometimes actually results in an inferior recipe. ie: Gnudi

Tim


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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:22 am 
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Location: Six Shooter Junction, Texas
Darcie wrote:
Paul Kierstead wrote:
I'm sure not eating from their (the organization skewering CI) cookbook!

Yeah, plain boiled chicken breast (because I guess salt, grilling and fat WILL.KILL.YOU.) is not on my menu.

I think the negativity of folks like that will lead to an earlier death than eating a grilled bratwurst now and then. Or at least perhaps they will just wish they were dead. :twisted:


I couldn't agree more...viva la butter!

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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:34 pm 
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From the Desk of CPK

Cooks Illustrated Magazine is now in its twentieth year of bringing our faithful readers the best uber-persnickety recipes and innovative techniques that we have purloined or stolen from hard working yet obscure chefs that actually know what they are doing. in the kitchen.

Send us a few Quid and we will send you a dozen tired, redone, inauthentic, and dumbed down recipes six times each year. We will demand nothing less than your slavish adherence to our punctilious instructions and will make you guess how many and which steps serve no purpose at all except to dirty two ore three additional pans for no reason except WE CAN.,

Hold on tight to your wallets ‘cause we will come after you for subscriptions to another lame magazine, two or three web sites and cookbooks galore. We won’t stop until your cry uncle, but you may be a better cook when we are done with you.

For your convenience we now offer one-click fleecing that will bring you a little bit of everything for the LOW LOW price of $19.95 per week. Two Magazine, three web sites, as many cookbooks as we can fit in your mailbox as well as our online Cooking School. Don’t Delay! This is a limited time offer! Cancel at any time, but don’t expect any money back.

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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:35 pm 
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:D :D :D

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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:20 pm 
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Jim, that is hilarious.

I've given up everything except the bound annuals for both CI and CC. My OC nature will find it difficult to stop that, and for the sake of my eventual estate sale/bequest I will probably keep collecting them until the bitter end.


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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:24 pm 
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Darcie wrote:
Jim, that is hilarious.

I've given up everything except the bound annuals for both CI and CC. My OC nature will find it difficult to stop that, and for the sake of my eventual estate sale/bequest I will probably keep collecting them until the bitter end.



Well, to be fair, I think CC is actually getting better.


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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:49 pm 
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Location: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Getting worse was hardly an option... :lol: :twisted:


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 Post subject: Re: following instructions, or not...
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:37 pm 
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Paul Kierstead wrote:
In the method I was referring to, the time period between undercooked and overcooked egg yolks is a few seconds (maybe 5, even less if the heat is higher). Either case will likely cause the resultant sauce to break when you add the butter. OTOH, the bain-marie method (or blender method) it is hard to go wrong if you remotely follow directions.


Yeah, I suppose I have a lot of experience cooking eggs; it was the first thing I learned to cook, at 12 years old. So I don't even think of it as difficult, the only secret is not to step away from the pan until the sauce emulsifies. Actually, a lot of basic recipes I've been told are "hard" are difficult specifically because the cook needs to pay close attention through the whole recipe, which is hard for a lot of people to do.

jim262 wrote:
For your convenience we now offer one-click fleecing that will bring you a little bit of everything for the LOW LOW price of $19.95 per week. Two Magazine, three web sites, as many cookbooks as we can fit in your mailbox as well as our online Cooking School. Don’t Delay! This is a limited time offer! Cancel at any time, but don’t expect any money back.


Now that you put it that way, I don't know why I ever cancelled (gets out credit cards).

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