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Organic AP flour suggestions?
http://cookaholics.org/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2213		 Page 1 of 5
Author:  la peca [ Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Organic AP flour suggestions?
I'm generally a KA gal, but even my many local co-ops don't sell the KA organic AP flour. *sigh* it's an expensive experiment to test them all, so I wonder if any serious bakers have found a successful organic flour to recommend?
Author:  JesBelle [ Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Sorry, flour doesn't have enough problems for it to get on my list of "Things Which Must Be Organic." I do use Arrowhead Mills Organic Rye Flour, mostly because I can get it in brick and mortar stores unlike pretty much any other rye. Co-ops are usually happy to make special orders, though. Have you asked?
Author:  la peca [ Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Still waiting to hear. I'm still interested to know some bakers successes.
Author:  TheFuzzy [ Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Well, we use Butte Creek Mill flour, which is the best consumer-grade flour I can get my hands on (Giusto's is probably better, but they sell only to bakeries). When we're out of Butte Creek, Bob's Red Mill (which is distributed to many health food markets in the West), is pretty good. I don't know that it's necessarily better than Arrowhead, though; I haven't done a comparison.

FWIW, from a quality perspective, organic doesn't matter much. What matters is cold milling, which preserves the full chemical structure of the flour, as opposed to higher-volume hot milling which parches it and breaks down some of the starches and proteins. It happens, though, that most cold milled flours are organic.
Author:  la peca [ Fri May 04, 2012 6:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
I paid an arm and a leg *eep!* through the co-op to have it special-ordered. It would have been less-money to have purchased via KA's website, with a free shipping special, but that wouldn't be supporting my local co-op, would it? :) The KA AP does have a slightly higher protein, so thus far I've just used about a 1 T less in the recipes, and it's been good. I haven't seen and significant issues (whee!), so I'm happy with it. I had to buy a case (6 bags), so I've got lots of time to figure it out. There's always the idea to "cut" the flour with some starch or sorts, as well.
Author:  Tunaoue [ Mon May 07, 2012 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
My ignorance and inquisitiveness is getting the better of me.
Years ago I took a class called horticulture. Fancy-smancy word for gardening.
We learned that all living things are chemically carbon-based, aka: organic.
But in horticulture there was another definition of organic: items grown using plant foods (fertilizer, plant nutrition) that were created using composting or fermented without chemical intervention from humans. It includes pesticides.

Aside from the major issue I have with the term "organic" (they couldn't be more imaginative and called it something functional like "primitive", "conservative", "sacred", "holistic" they had to confuse everyone instead?) I see "organics" as a moral check against what could be an unrestrained big business venture. It's a protest against industries that may be taking too many liberties with our health. Bravo! I say - to a point anyway. (What if their progressive direction, was eventually the correct one?)

Apologies for the digression. Today the term organic is is somewhat broad. There is still loads of human chemical intervention used in "organic" farming. It just has some "reasonable" restrictions (whatever that means).

But wheat is still wheat; AP flour is AP flour. Unless the wheat strain (breed) is different, it's the same.

So with the industry becoming more aware of better earthly management of crops, I wonder if organic AP flour is any different than "generic" AP flour (sorry - I have no idea what generic means either).

Other than MAYBE there is a lesser impact to the environment with a earth-nice process, the final product should be the same. Arguably better with generics. So if you want a better cake, get the tried and true dependable stuff. If you want to save the world, go with "organic".

It's kind of like cars; you can get a Prius and feel good about yourself. Or you can get a Corvette and make yourself feel good. There's no wrong answer here.
(I think Fuzzy's reply was more to the point though)

Just ranting while my wife does her hair, . . .
"Honey, you done yet?"
Author:  JesBelle [ Mon May 07, 2012 2:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Tunaoue -- The usual term for "opposite of organic" is "conventionally grown". Because, apparently, the more nature one extracts from the process, the more conventional it becomes?
Author:  Tunaoue [ Mon May 07, 2012 6:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
JesBelle wrote:
The usual term for "opposite of organic" is "conventionally grown".
Because, apparently, the more nature one extracts from the process, the more conventional it becomes?


Methinks they are attempting to describe the current industrial farming "conventions", but it still doesn't ring true to my ears.
At least they are trying to identify the differences. (Hooray for them).

Back to la peca's question: perhaps a cooking school would know the answer. I'd expect them to do research testing.
Author:  TheFuzzy [ Tue May 08, 2012 12:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Tunaoue wrote:
Aside from the major issue I have with the term "organic" (they couldn't be more imaginative and called it something functional like "primitive", "conservative", "sacred", "holistic" they had to confuse everyone instead?) I see "organics" as a moral check against what could be an unrestrained big business venture. It's a protest against industries that may be taking too many liberties with our health. Bravo! I say - to a point anyway. (What if their progressive direction, was eventually the correct one?)


This was the conception, certainly. However, Whole Foods, Wal-Mart and their suppliers have shown us that you can have an organic food business which is nevertheless large-scale, high-energy-consumption, and viciously competitive. So while "organic" may have once meant slow-food, high-quality, localvore, the concept of not using petroleum-based fertilizers and pesticides is wholly separable from other "food reform" concepts.

On the other hand, they are selling more nutritious produce, and are decreasing the depletion of the soil and pollution from pesticide runoff. So it's still progress, even if it wasn't all the progress we wanted.
Author:  Darcie [ Wed May 09, 2012 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Organic AP flour suggestions?
Quote:
On the other hand, they are selling more nutritious produce...

Is there any data to back up this claim? Althought I would like to believe it, it would be nice to see some numbers to support it.
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